"Living is the slowest form of suicide" — Enrique De La Cruz, our interviewee

Enrique De La Cruz is a Ph.D. and respected in his field.
We enountered him at a conference on motorproteins in Banff, Canada.
We wanted to publish his thoughts in Shebang because:

INTERVIEW: Enrique De La Cruz spoke with Jack Klaff, Starlab’s Professor of the Public Understanding of Science

Jack: There’re guys who are good at science and then there are guys who are just really interesting people who happen to be good at science as well.
You’re unquestionably a character. [Enrique is laughing] You know?
You could cultivate that, but I don’t think you do, you are completely yourself but you are distinct in this environment. You’ve stuck to who you are, which is great. How’s it feel though?

Enrique: Kind of sucks to be honest with you. The thing that we always look for - as we enter any field, whether it’s a relationship with a person or a relationship with your colleagues - ultimately what we all want is some form of acceptance.
And you know, I think that as a group, these people are very accepting and very supportive.
But there's always something in the back of your mind that makes you recognize there is something different about you - whether its your history, your past, or simply your perception of yourself. Or maybe its simply because people tell you, as you just told me.
It's hard to identify with these people completely, on a bigger scale completely. I identify with them on a scientific basis but that's really just a small part of the big picture. It’s nice... but there's a lot of you that's lacking.
And its not something you can explain to someone: it’s either they understand it or they don't. (And it’s not as if I'm the most articulate person that I could explain it to them anyway.)
The other effect of this is that the people that do understand you - the people that do have the same past as you, the people that you grew up with — you’re detaching yourself from them, simultaneously, you know. Because every time I go back to see my friends they’re doing what they’re doing - the same thing they were doing 15 years ago, except now you know they are just a little bit heavier and a little more tired and a little bit older.
And you realize that you’re somewhere in between, but it’s not even somewhere in between. You realize you’re in two different places and its almost like falling in and out of character. There’s this part of you that's different from just your history, how and where you grew up, different background - you know, I didn't come from an upper-class neighbourhood like many of my colleagues, I didn't ... my family is from a different country.
I grew up listening to punk rock and playing soccer and playing music and this is what -these are the people I identify with.
But I feel perfectly comfortable around people who are addicted and depressed, and you know, just "out of it". And at the same time I still feel perfectly at ease around people who are straight pegs and professionals and academics and thinkers. Um, but it’s almost like two different people.

Jack: Two different people?

Enrique: It feels like it most of the time and that's, that's hard to deal with.
And I think the reason it sucks, the reason I would say that it sucks, is because these two people, these two characters, these two personalities - uh, don't like each other.
You know if they liked each other and they loved each other that would be fine but, they they hate each other you know.
The rebellious anti-authority one, the one that’s just into living life for the day and not thinking about anything except the experiences of what's going on. That one hates the one who’s thinking about problems and obsessing about things that probably ultimately really don't matter.
And I don't know how to deal with this and its depressing and its hard.
But it’s almost like you’re in so deep...
And there's this aspect where you know that what you do, you do well and, because you enjoy it, you don't want to stop.
So, I don't know. I really don't know. It’s good and bad at the same time.
I guess it’s a tragedy in a strange sense because there's doesn't seem to be any obvious resolution in hand.

Jack: Would it make a difference if you had some other guy just arrive on the scene from the same kind of background as you?

Enrique: Yeah. Actually it turns out I do have one friend and I saw him at the University.
And the reason that I even went up to him and talked to him was because I saw he was smoking cigarettes and he had this punk rock T-shirt on and so I was like "Hey, you know I know that record label, you know they put out one of the records of my band".
And I was talking to him and he has the same kind of background, he grew up thinking that there's basically no future.
I don't know if this is a cultural thing, an economic thing, or even just a musical thing.
It turns out he grew up listening to punk rock, he spent his time playing in punk rock bands and doing these kinds of things. And your mentality is that you know, "Fuck the future, who cares about tomorrow, its never… its not even gonna be there."
But then you realize that it is, you know? And so then you have to do something about it, and prepare yourself for it and so you try to put yourself into this (referring to science) environment where there is some hope.
But I don't know if that’s what you fear the most. Maybe what you fear is actually some weird form of fear of some acclamation of some sort. Because it seems that at least as teenagers or youth, the sound and the spirit of youth, the spirit of rebellion is all about opposition, and it’s all about, expressing yourself and being independent.
And when you start entering this field - I don't know if it’s true, but there's this notion that you have to try to become like your peers, and this is hard, and perhaps I’ve refused.
And I don't know if its made me successful because my science is good, or successful just because people are like "What the hell’s wrong with this guy?" [Slight chuckle]

Jack: I have to say there is another alternative. The people in the audience when you gave your paper: to me... I felt that they love you.

Enrique: Oh, I hope so. I mean I think so too. It’s strange.
My girlfriend was always so surprised when she would see me interact with these people, because she would say to me, "You know, it’s so bizarre because your superiors here, they treat you like an equal."
I'm not a professor, I'm still a post-doc and when I was a student it was the same.
And this amazed her and it amazed other people that I would feel perfectly comfortable around them and they would feel perfectly comfortable around me and treat me as someone who was at the same level as them even though I was so much lower than they were. Um, but this is when I think it’s almost a perception of yourself, not real, not a reality.

Jack: There's a big difference between stupidity and something you don't know yet.

Enrique: Sure, ignorance. I mean it would be ignorance in a sense.

Jack: You’re not ignorant, I mean you’re unaware

Enrique: [Saying it at the same time Jack is] unaware, unaware.

Jack: Well you’re on the way, you’re doing stuff, you’re holding your own and they love you for it, and that’s what's great, that’s what's really a tribute to you. My point is not that you are different and "ohh isn't that exciting" but you are who you are, and most people don't learn that lesson. Ever.

Enrique: You think?

Jack: [Laughs] For sure! I haven't learnt that lesson.

Enrique: I guess you come from the arts and I guess I do too because the thing that… one thing that I love, the one thing that sets me free is music. So I've got my little ear phones on you know. That's the one thing, its better than any drug…it’s almost better than sex, unless you can have music and sex at the same time [Laughter]
[Laughing]) uh, which is a nice combination...

Jack: Yeah, I think that's true but I have to say, "You love this stuff". Science.

Enrique: I absolutely love this stuff! I love this stupid shit. (Laughing) I do. I mean I I I just, I I I do love this, you know, thinking about this stuff.
It just it occupies my mind. I don't know why I like this stuff because it really doesn't matter in the end you know. And I ask myself everyday "why the hell do I do this?" You know I mean I don't know why I do this. I like it. But I don’t know why I do this. Go figure.

Jack: You really don't? You're serious?

Enrique: I honestly don't know why I do this. I don't.

Jack: You love it though.

Enrique: I love it.

Jack: So that's why you do it.

Enrique: That's why I do it, yeah right. [Laughing] That's reason enough.

Jack: "I don't know why I do it, but I love it."

Enrique: I do love it, but I also hate it at the same time.